Picture or no picture?

sammy the snake · Post by **sammy the snake** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 11:04 am

My goal here is not to bash any one person.Just looking for some one to explain to me when I reply to a listing here on qth to buy a radio,the seller replys back with " pictures mean nothing to me,have been in radio for 46 years
people can just as easily steal any kind of picture from the web and send it to anyone check my feedback on qth........."

I have read the sellers feedback ,however would still like to see item and even talk with seller,My gut sence guides me more then feedback forums.

So I guess my questions are " Is feed back the only real way to trust someone you don't know?"

"Do you have no sense if you ask for a picture"

I guess my gut feeling is if someone wants to sell me something and they steal a picture from the web "are they selling something stolen ?" umm

My gran ma would say two things when you deal with buyers and sellers for anything "If it sounds to good to be true..." and "in GOD we trust all others pay cash"

Thanks looking forward to some insight.

Joe ki4lnm

k4kk · Post by **k4kk** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:47 pm

Pictures mean little but they mean something. I've bought from pictures and been disappointed and without pictures and been thrilled. You can do a lot with camera angles to conceal defects but you can't cover up destruction. I do a lot based on gut feel and have only been wrong one time. That piece of whale crap has managed to stay out of my reach for over a decade. I haven't forgotten!

N9LCD · Post by **N9LCD** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 3:01 pm

Joe, you're right. Talking to a seller, looking at pictures, and using your "gut sense" CAN tell you more than feedback.

X3BUL's opinion of a seller help's, but it's your money and your opinion is the one that counts.

Talking to the seller really helps. If he (or she) can't explain what they're selling, there's the distinct possibility that they didn't know how to use it and may have damaged it. Or if they're unwilling to discuss specifics they may be trying to hide something. And sellers who won't give you a one word "YES" or "NO" answer may be trying to baffle you with male bovine excrement.

As for "stealing pictures" on-line, that refers to downloading pictures of gear from the manufacture's website, on-line catalogs, Rig-Pix or any place with pictures of gear in "perfect" condition. A deceptive if not downright fraudulent practice. You're not buying stolen equipment, but it's getting close.

ETERNAL VIGILENCE OR ETERNAL REGRET!

73!

N9LCD

N9LCD · Post by **N9LCD** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 7:37 pm

I agree with K4KK and K9XR.

I've seen way too many ads with long-distance shots where you can't see any details on the rig or blurred, useless close-ups. Photos are only useful if they communicate!

It's what inside and what comes out the output terminals that counts.

I think photos are useful if you're selling relatively undocumented gear. But photos of an FT-817ND???

If the buyer wants a photo or two, sure. After all, it's his money you want. But eight or ten photos of one rig? NO WAY!

N9LCD

kg8lb · Post by **kg8lb** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 11:03 pm

[quote="K9XR"]I think Pictures are WAAYY Over-rated. I also think that some of the usual "tire kickers" around here must collect them.
[quote]

WOW ! And I thought it was just me..

I HATE having to take photos. In fact not taking photos is a strong incentive for me to list here rather than ebay. Never fails, give a very honest description of a piece of gear and all you get are photo requests. 90% of the requests are followed by non-responses ...or at least so it seems .

Makes me wonder if these folks are using my pics to sell something they don't own..who knows.

kg4mlo · Post by **kg4mlo** » Sun Sep 04, 2011 7:38 am

SAMMY THE SNAKE ??????

Hammyguy · Post by **Hammyguy** » Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:08 am

kg8lb wrote:
K9XR wrote:I think Pictures are WAAYY Over-rated. I also think that some of the usual "tire kickers" around here must collect them.

WOW ! And I thought it was just me..

I HATE having to take photos. In fact not taking photos is a strong incentive for me to list here rather than ebay. Never fails, give a very honest description of a piece of gear and all you get are photo requests. 90% of the requests are followed by non-responses ...or at least so it seems .

Makes me wonder if these folks are using my pics to sell something they don't own..who knows.

Selling anything here or on eBay can be a pain in the butt. But pictures are part of the selling process. With pictures your item will sell far quicker. While 10 years ago, it might have been the norm to not have pics due to bandwidth considerations etc. But nowadays there really is no good reason not to have them available. Yes it means putting the rig on a good background and taking pics from various angles. That's the biggest pain in the butt. Sending them out is the easy part.

KA2CDT · Post by **KA2CDT** » Sun Sep 04, 2011 12:53 pm

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. Mint,pristine,excellent condition means nothing. The first thing someone asks when a person posts a complaint on here about a sour deal is "you mean you bought the radio without seeing any pictures"?

W4LTD · Post by **W4LTD** » Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:19 pm

With today's high-definition and high megapixel cameras, the photos are usually more detailed and descriptive than the naked eye can see. In most circumstances, an item photographed with a 10-megapixel camera will actually look better "in person". I usually feel much safer when I see a photo and can usually disseminate "fake" or stock photos. Of course, there are no fool-proof methods to avoid being scammed, but a picture can [sometimes] tell a thousand words...

kg8lb · Post by **kg8lb** » Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:31 pm

Just sold a Drake R8A here on QTH based on the description. I have bought many items the same way . What a relief, the buyer did not need a photo to realize what a Drake R8A looks like . By his feedback it seems he is quite satisfied that my description was indeed accurate.Then again , anything I sell is backed 100% .
My own preferrence is to sell "pick up " only , A whole lot less hassle, After taking the time to take photos it gets real close to just putting the thing on ebay. I know that is a bad word but I always offer for local sale on one of the nets or offer here on QTH before resorting to ebay sales . However once I have to take photos , the item generally only remains offered at the low listing price for a day or two. It then goes to ebay.

Yes, there are so many that put in their photo request but never so much as a "got them" in return . Tire kickers are just a part of the fabric, an inescapable annoyance I guess. No big deal, life goes on. If this were my biggest complaint I guess life is pretty good eh ?

KE3W · Post by **KE3W** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:26 am

Well, FWIW - I bought a Argonaut 509 here. Yea, had a great picture of the front panel. My gut instinct was to ask for pictures all the way around the unit but heck, it was an Argonaut 509 and the description just said how great it was. Well, I received the puppy and all the connections on the back (microphone, key, etc.) were changed to other configurations and connectors. Yea, that meant I had to redo all the connections for my keyer, microphone, etc. Shame on me for not asking the right questions and shame on the seller for not specifying here that he butchered all the connections on the back. So to all of you who seem to have a problem with buyer's asking for pictures, etc. - tough - it is part of making a sale. And as far as the "Tire kickers are just a part of the fabric" - sorry, but when I am going to spend money on something that might end up being a piece of crap - I will kick all the tires to make sure it is what I want - part of doing business through the net.

sammy the snake · Post by **sammy the snake** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:36 am

Thanks guys you cleared up a few things and I understand better.
First "sammy the fish"just happen to pop into my head a that moment my call is ki4lnm.

First if you ask for a picture" you are not an idiot or have no sense"
Second "Is the seller hiding something "Broken items? Stolen? "

I was told once "if I wanted to be trusted I had to do somethings to earn it"
I don't trust feedbacks by them selfs.

I don't ask for a picture to see what it looks like.I ask to see how close of dissciprtion you gave is real or if you are hiding something. "A problem piece of equippment? Stolen?or Broken?" umm

How would the seller that treated me nasty, think about the feedback I give "how he replied with insulting emails."
I didn't think so!

I like dealing with buyers and sellers here on qth,have a couple of people who are now friends.After all as ham operators we just don't handle emergency stuff but "goodwill thru radio" Think how much better our COUNTRY would be if we all practiced that here on qth,the radio,and just every day stuff.

Keep up the great work QTH.I won't let one seller being nasty slow me down.

Have a wonderful day everyone and thanks for the input
Joe aka( sammy the fish)
ki4lnm

lhk0pd · Post by **lhk0pd** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:53 pm

I agree Pictures are not all what there cut out to believe. My experience has been that most of the time the pictures showed what i was buying but not how well it worked plus pic's usually do not show up any hidden defects the sellers is not mentioning. I recently was trying to sell my FT 950 and the guy most interested asked for a simple picture which i gave him and realized his request was pretty smart. He asked that i take a picture of the radio with a glass on top or in front of the radio. I gave him both ways.This showed to him it was not a stolen pic an was my radio i was selling . But the sellers personal description goes a long way in helping me to decide plus there feed back. By the way the buyer an i could not agree on a price so it still could be for sale but then again i'm in no hurry to sell it.

w7why · Post by **w7why** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:49 am

K9XR wrote:I think Pictures are WAAYY Over-rated. I also think that some of the usual "tire kickers" around here must collect them.

Yes and no.

If there any flaws in the equipment you are selling, showing them in a picture can save a lot of grief later. Someone can't complain there is a scratch on the display if you show a picture of it and say it is there. 73
Tom W7WHY

kg8lb · Post by **kg8lb** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 10:46 am

KE3W wrote:Well, FWIW - I bought a Argonaut 509 here. Yea, had a great picture of the front panel. My gut instinct was to ask for pictures all the way around the unit but heck, it was an Argonaut 509 and the description just said how great it was. Well, I received the puppy and all the connections on the back (microphone, key, etc.) were changed to other configurations and connectors. Yea, that meant I had to redo all the connections for my keyer, microphone, etc. Shame on me for not asking the right questions and shame on the seller for not specifying here that he butchered all the connections on the back. So to all of you who seem to have a problem with buyer's asking for pictures, etc. - tough - it is part of making a sale. And as far as the "Tire kickers are just a part of the fabric" - sorry, but when I am going to spend money on something that might end up being a piece of crap - I will kick all the tires to make sure it is what I want - part of doing business through the net.

Oh, I always send photos if the tire kickers request them. I have no problem doing that . Usually my prices are good enough that the item is sold long before the photos are sent. I offer a 100% money back anyhow. Most photos don't show how well the gear works.
If the item has not sold by the time the photos go out , it is not very long before the item moves over to ebay. Once on ebay they almost always sell for far more than my ham-friendly price offered here on QTH . Snoozers are losers.

KE3W · Post by **KE3W** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:47 am

kg8lb wrote:I always send photos if the tire kickers request them. I have no problem doing that...

Yea, if I had seen a picture of the backside of the 509 - I would have been able to tell immediately that the connections were changed. In the future - I will ask for pictures.

NY7Q · Post by **NY7Q** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:38 pm

Pick up a HRO catalog and look at the pic.
Or, just google the rig on internet.
What's the big deal about a pix.

kg8lb · Post by **kg8lb** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:55 pm

KE3W wrote:
kg8lb wrote:I always send photos if the tire kickers request them. I have no problem doing that...
Yea, if I had seen a picture of the backside of the 509 - I would have been able to tell immediately that the connections were changed. In the future - I will ask for pictures.

If you had bought it from me without the photo, #1 I would have mentioned the mods, #2 If you asked for a photo of the mods you would have received photos (provided it had not sold already) and the big plus...If you were not 100% satisfied when the radio arrived I would have given you a full refund. The refund policy heads off a lot of bad will in the long run . Then again, I have never been asked for a refund. Still, having a refund understanding and good feedback are more effective for me than photos.

KE3W · Post by **KE3W** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:03 pm

kg8lb wrote:...If you had bought it from me without the photo, #1 I would have mentioned the mods, #2 If you asked for a photo of the mods you would have received photos (provided it had not sold already) and the big plus...If you were not 100% satisfied when the radio arrived I would have given you a full refund...

Hopefully, my next purchase will be from a Ham like yourself!

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