IT DOESN'T GET MUCH WORSE THAN THIS...TYPICAL TYPICAL TYPICAL UPS STORE HORROR!!!!! NAME REMOVED FROM THE YAESU REFLECTOR POST
From:
Subject: [FTdx-9000]
To: FTdx-9000@yahoogrou ps.com
Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 8:29 PM
TO ALL YAESU GROUP MEMBERS:
ON OR ABOUT JUNE 20 2007 I RECEIVED A PHONE CALL FROM MR. XXXX FROM YAESU.
HE INFORMED THAT I WAS UP ON THE LIST FOR THE PEP UPGRADE AFTER WAITING ABOUT 6 MONTHS I WAS SO HAPPY.
UPS WAS TO PICK UP THE 9000D SOMETIME ON THAT FOLLOWING MONDAY.
WELL ON FRIDAY I WENT TO BOX UP THE RIG AND FOUND THAT I WAS MISSING A INSERT TO THE ORIGINAL CARTON.
AT THAT TIME I CALL XXXXXXXXX AND TOLD HIM THAT I WANTED A NEW BOX SHIPPED FOR THE AMOUNT OF 20 DOLLARS. HE THEN PROCEEDED TO TELL ME THAT IT WAS NOT NECESSARY TO HAVE THE NEW BOX SHIPPED AND ASKED ME IF A HAD A UPS PACKING STORE CLOSE BY . I TOLD HIM
I DID AND HE SAID TO BRING THE RADIO TO THEM LET THEM BOX IT AND HE WOULD CHANGE THE CALL TAG TO THAT UPS PACKING STORE ADDRESS.
WELL I WAS OK WITH THAT.LET ME MAKE IT KNOWN THAT I KNOW THE OWNER OF THE UPS STORE VERY WELL BEEN SHIPPING THINGS THERE FOR YRS.
AS I PAID THE 60 DOLLARS MR. JOSEPH THE OWNER TOLD M EXXX I WILL TAKE GOOD CARE OF THIS ONE FOR YOU I KNOW HOW MUCH THIS RADIO MEANS TO YOU..WELL
EVERYTHING WAS GREAT UNTIL 5 DAYS LATER WHEN XXXXXXX CALLED ME AT WORK AND INFORMED ME THAT MY RADIO WAS DAMAGED IN SHIPPING.
WELL AT THAT TIME I TOLD HIM THAT THE BALL WAS IN HIS COURT AND LET ME KNOW WHEN I WILL BE RECEIVING MY NEW RADIO.
WELL IT IS GOING ON 3 MONTHS AND STILL NO RESULTS,
THE UPS IN CALIFORNIA ARE BLAMING THE UPS PACKING STORE . UPS STORE SAID THEY PACKED IT TO SPECS.
I AM VERY DISAPPOINTED IN THE WAY THIS IS GOING.I LOVE MY RADIO AND MISS USING IT..
I AM A BIG DXER AND ENJOY RAG CHEWING FOR THOSE WHO HAVE TALKED WITH ME THEY ALWAYS COMPLIMENTED ME ON MY AUDIO.. I AM ASKING FOR YOUR ADVICE .
PLEASE HELP ..
WHEN WILL THE HAM COMMUNITY REALIZE THAT WE NEED TO STAY AWAY FROM THE HACKS AND INEXPERIENCED NOVICE TRAINEES AT THE UPS STORES. ABOVE IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF THEIR INCOMPETENCE!
ANOTHER UPS STORE NIGHTMARE FOLLOW UP TO TERRY N8ERM
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As of Dec 9, 2013: ONLY BUYERS AND SELLERS directly involved with a transaction can post here. Do not post replies in any topic if you are not the buyer or seller in the transaction being discussed! If you believe you can help the buyer or seller, please use the Private Message system to communicate with them. NOTE: if you have been scammed by someone pretending to be a ham, please post in the Scammer Reports forum instead. See viewtopic.php?f=2&t=136 for additional rules.
As of Dec 9, 2013: ONLY BUYERS AND SELLERS directly involved with a transaction can post here. Do not post replies in any topic if you are not the buyer or seller in the transaction being discussed! If you believe you can help the buyer or seller, please use the Private Message system to communicate with them. NOTE: if you have been scammed by someone pretending to be a ham, please post in the Scammer Reports forum instead. See viewtopic.php?f=2&t=136 for additional rules.
How to totally avoid UPS STORTS--Do it yourself...
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The only way to KNOW you gear is packed correctly is to pack it yourself. Here is how.
HOW TO PACK HAM ELECTRONIC GEAR
Proper packing is the single most important step in conducting business on the Internet, yet often receives the least attention.
Assumptions
A gorilla, larger than you can imagine, will throw your package at least 30 feet to another large gorilla. The second gorilla will not catch it and it will slam against the brick wall and drop to the concrete floor.
You will have to file a damage claim if you do not PROPERLY pack the item. Dealing with damage claims is a REAL hassle, likely to involve much paper work and hard feelings. It will make you very cranky.
The Reality
All shipping carriers, including the U.S. Postal Service, have automated their distribution systems, using bar codes to route packages. It is likely your shipment will be moved through the read-and-sort process using conveyer belts. The conveyer system will drop your package from one belt to another at heights of up to 40 inches. This means that your package will experience a free fall drop(s) at some phase of being carried from your QTH to its destination. IF YOU DON'T PACK IT PROPERLY, IT WILL BE DAMAGED.
Insurance
Always insure the package for one and one-half times its ACTUAL REPLACEMENT VALUE.
MINIMUM Requirement
Any package should be packed in such a manner that the contents of the package will not be damaged if the package is dropped from the height of a normal shipping counter to the floor, a distance of about 40 inches or three and one half feet.
Step by Step Procedure to assure it getting there undamaged
1. Place item in plastic bag or other suitable plastic cover to protect it from packing materials and moisture. Same with any extra small items, manual, accessories, etc. Remember, the vibration of a long haul truck can completely wear the paint off a surface rubbing against packing material.
2. Wrap item in at least five layers of large size bubble wrap. This is to reduce VIBRATION damage.
3. Place item in suitable size cardboard box, preferably one that snuggly fits the item with it bubble wrapping, including any accessories. Fill any spaces in the box with dense foam sheeting (NOT Styrofoam “peanuts”!) so the item fit TIGHT in the box. DO NOT USE NEWSPAPER, WADDED PLASTIC OR ANYTHING NOT DESIGNED FOR THE PURPOSE. DO NOT USE “PEANUTS”; THEY WILL BE GROUND TO MUSH IF YOU DO, AND SO WILL YOUR EQUIPMENT.
4. Seal the box carefully. Double tape everything. The better it is sealed, the better it will absorb the shock of being dropped.
5. Next the sealed box goes inside a second box leaving at least two inches of space between the boxes on ALL sides.. Note: if a DOUBLE WALL outer box is of sufficient strength, a second box may not be necessary. If in doubt, use a second box!
6. Prior to placing the smaller box inside the larger, place two sheets of dense foam board in and on the bottom of the large box. This is to strengthen the bottom of the two-box container you are building. IMPORTANT: For LARGE HEAVY items, there should be at least two inches of DENSE FOAM sheets. DO NOT USE STYROFOAM SHEETS. DO NOT USE STYROFOAM PEANUTS OR ANY OTHER LOOSE MATERIAL. (Note: the “pink” dense one inch foam board available at Home Depot is perfect for this application. Lowe’s has the same type foam but in blue..
7. After placing the smaller box in the larger, place foam board on all sides and the top of the smaller sealed box. Fill all remaining space in the second box, leaving NO air space at the top. The inner "first" box MUST be securely held in place so it will not shift when you shake the package,
8. Seal the second box with packing tape then over the top and bottom "lids" again. Double tape everything.
9. IMPORTANT: place on each surface, except the bottom, stickers or signs indicating that the contents of the package is FRAGILE ELECTRONIC INSTRUMENT and DO NOT DROP. If you fail to do this, the package WILL BE HANDLED AS IF IT WERE A BOX OF ROCKS!
10. Place address label on top of package, completely taping over with clear packing tape. Be sure to insure the package for twice it actual worth. Also ask your carrier to include the recipient’s email address in the shipping paperwork to be sure he gets reports as to the progress of the shipping.
11. IMPORTANT: Immediately after shipping please forward the tracking number the recipient so he/she can make arrangement to be available to sign for the package when it arrives
de K4ICL
.
The only way to KNOW you gear is packed correctly is to pack it yourself. Here is how.
HOW TO PACK HAM ELECTRONIC GEAR
Proper packing is the single most important step in conducting business on the Internet, yet often receives the least attention.
Assumptions
A gorilla, larger than you can imagine, will throw your package at least 30 feet to another large gorilla. The second gorilla will not catch it and it will slam against the brick wall and drop to the concrete floor.
You will have to file a damage claim if you do not PROPERLY pack the item. Dealing with damage claims is a REAL hassle, likely to involve much paper work and hard feelings. It will make you very cranky.
The Reality
All shipping carriers, including the U.S. Postal Service, have automated their distribution systems, using bar codes to route packages. It is likely your shipment will be moved through the read-and-sort process using conveyer belts. The conveyer system will drop your package from one belt to another at heights of up to 40 inches. This means that your package will experience a free fall drop(s) at some phase of being carried from your QTH to its destination. IF YOU DON'T PACK IT PROPERLY, IT WILL BE DAMAGED.
Insurance
Always insure the package for one and one-half times its ACTUAL REPLACEMENT VALUE.
MINIMUM Requirement
Any package should be packed in such a manner that the contents of the package will not be damaged if the package is dropped from the height of a normal shipping counter to the floor, a distance of about 40 inches or three and one half feet.
Step by Step Procedure to assure it getting there undamaged
1. Place item in plastic bag or other suitable plastic cover to protect it from packing materials and moisture. Same with any extra small items, manual, accessories, etc. Remember, the vibration of a long haul truck can completely wear the paint off a surface rubbing against packing material.
2. Wrap item in at least five layers of large size bubble wrap. This is to reduce VIBRATION damage.
3. Place item in suitable size cardboard box, preferably one that snuggly fits the item with it bubble wrapping, including any accessories. Fill any spaces in the box with dense foam sheeting (NOT Styrofoam “peanuts”!) so the item fit TIGHT in the box. DO NOT USE NEWSPAPER, WADDED PLASTIC OR ANYTHING NOT DESIGNED FOR THE PURPOSE. DO NOT USE “PEANUTS”; THEY WILL BE GROUND TO MUSH IF YOU DO, AND SO WILL YOUR EQUIPMENT.
4. Seal the box carefully. Double tape everything. The better it is sealed, the better it will absorb the shock of being dropped.
5. Next the sealed box goes inside a second box leaving at least two inches of space between the boxes on ALL sides.. Note: if a DOUBLE WALL outer box is of sufficient strength, a second box may not be necessary. If in doubt, use a second box!
6. Prior to placing the smaller box inside the larger, place two sheets of dense foam board in and on the bottom of the large box. This is to strengthen the bottom of the two-box container you are building. IMPORTANT: For LARGE HEAVY items, there should be at least two inches of DENSE FOAM sheets. DO NOT USE STYROFOAM SHEETS. DO NOT USE STYROFOAM PEANUTS OR ANY OTHER LOOSE MATERIAL. (Note: the “pink” dense one inch foam board available at Home Depot is perfect for this application. Lowe’s has the same type foam but in blue..
7. After placing the smaller box in the larger, place foam board on all sides and the top of the smaller sealed box. Fill all remaining space in the second box, leaving NO air space at the top. The inner "first" box MUST be securely held in place so it will not shift when you shake the package,
8. Seal the second box with packing tape then over the top and bottom "lids" again. Double tape everything.
9. IMPORTANT: place on each surface, except the bottom, stickers or signs indicating that the contents of the package is FRAGILE ELECTRONIC INSTRUMENT and DO NOT DROP. If you fail to do this, the package WILL BE HANDLED AS IF IT WERE A BOX OF ROCKS!
10. Place address label on top of package, completely taping over with clear packing tape. Be sure to insure the package for twice it actual worth. Also ask your carrier to include the recipient’s email address in the shipping paperwork to be sure he gets reports as to the progress of the shipping.
11. IMPORTANT: Immediately after shipping please forward the tracking number the recipient so he/she can make arrangement to be available to sign for the package when it arrives
de K4ICL
good stuff
al, good stuff. everything you say is 100% correct. lets add 3 additional points. first, with expensive equipment, take pictures of each packing step in the event that there is damage. they cannot dispute the packing with your pictures. two, take the boxes OPEN to an actual fed ex or ups distribution center with actual fed ex or ups employees. NOT THE BOGUS HACKERS AT AN INDEPENDENTLY OWNED UPS STORE. have the employee look at and approve the packing job and get the employees name. three, tell your receiver to save all packing. have him note on the signature line any outer box damage. MAKE SURE YOUR RECEIVER SAVES THE PACKING. if he throws out the packing, you have NO claim.
i have had a few damage claims with fed ex and ups. when the claims adjuster started with their smoke and mirrors, i shut them up right now and said, YOUR EMPLOYEE, john doe, AT THE CINCINNATI HUB APPROVED MY PACKING!!!
another thing to remember, ups and fed ex are self insured. their claims adjusters receive bonuses based upon how many claims they dont pay. be persistant and demanding. let them know that you will call them every 5 minutes for the rest of their lives until they pay your claim. their job is to intimidate you and make you go away or settle for pennies on the dollar. dont let them bully you!!!!!
happy hoss tradinh. paul w8jn
i have had a few damage claims with fed ex and ups. when the claims adjuster started with their smoke and mirrors, i shut them up right now and said, YOUR EMPLOYEE, john doe, AT THE CINCINNATI HUB APPROVED MY PACKING!!!
another thing to remember, ups and fed ex are self insured. their claims adjusters receive bonuses based upon how many claims they dont pay. be persistant and demanding. let them know that you will call them every 5 minutes for the rest of their lives until they pay your claim. their job is to intimidate you and make you go away or settle for pennies on the dollar. dont let them bully you!!!!!
happy hoss tradinh. paul w8jn
The UPS Depot in Madison Heights MI as well as many others will now REFUSE to insure ANY and ALL electronic items unless they are in the OEM shipping carton with all of the OEM packing materials..point blank.
The local pack and ship agent in Sterling Heights MI does a very good job of packing and the insurance is through them. If the item arrives damaged at all the payment goes to the shipper (seller) without delay. I have not had to file a claim but I know of one person who has and the UPS agent was prompt and forthright. Unlike the UPS Depot, The UPS Store will accept electronic gear not in the OEM packing if they know the person shipping or if they inspect and approve of the packing method. By inspecting, they are also able to ascertain there was no obvious damage to the item when it left. Shipping companies are inundated with purely fraudulent claims and these fraud freaks are driving up the costs for all of us exponentially.
In all of these years of shipping well over 1000 items up to the size of Globe King 500s VIA UPS, USPS and FedEx I had but one claim nearly 20 years ago and the buyer's girlfriend later admitted it was pure fraud on his part. A Yaesu FT-757 where the hillbilly CBer actually whacked the encoder knob on the end with a block of wood!
Life is too short...pack well, insure and worry not.
The local pack and ship agent in Sterling Heights MI does a very good job of packing and the insurance is through them. If the item arrives damaged at all the payment goes to the shipper (seller) without delay. I have not had to file a claim but I know of one person who has and the UPS agent was prompt and forthright. Unlike the UPS Depot, The UPS Store will accept electronic gear not in the OEM packing if they know the person shipping or if they inspect and approve of the packing method. By inspecting, they are also able to ascertain there was no obvious damage to the item when it left. Shipping companies are inundated with purely fraudulent claims and these fraud freaks are driving up the costs for all of us exponentially.
In all of these years of shipping well over 1000 items up to the size of Globe King 500s VIA UPS, USPS and FedEx I had but one claim nearly 20 years ago and the buyer's girlfriend later admitted it was pure fraud on his part. A Yaesu FT-757 where the hillbilly CBer actually whacked the encoder knob on the end with a block of wood!
Life is too short...pack well, insure and worry not.
information
gary, each hub manager receives a damage claim report comparing their hubs claims to the nation. they have the option locally to determine what they will and will not accept.if the hubs will not accept boxes that are not oem, then why would we expect ups to pay a claim on a shipment from a ups store hack when they place an expensive piece of equipment in a non oem box?
happy hoss trading paul w8jn
happy hoss trading paul w8jn
For a few reasons Paul. Firstly because they assume control over how it is packed. They also stand to make more money as they get a chunk of the packing feesand increased shipping cost. By packing themselves there is less chance for fraudulent claims as they are now able to get a good look at what they are assuming responsibility for. The refusals began here some time ago. Whenever I have the OEM box I take it directly to the UPS Depot, when there is no box , THe US Post Office or FedEx and at at times I take it to the UPS Store. My main reason for insurance is for protection from a lost package. I always box up as close to bullet proof as I can make it. So far so good.
agree!
gary,
i agree with everything you have said except..... the ups store has nothing to do with ups. they are not owned or controlled by ups. the ups stores are independent franchisees. if they botch a packing job (as they do 99% of the time with delicate electronics), the UPS company will kiss you goodbye since they do not have any business arrangement with you. the shipper IS the franchisee and you do not exist in the eyes of ups. you have no legal claim against ups. the court sees you as a third party, and a third party cannot bring a lawsuit against ups. you will now have to deal directly with the independent owner , who is not going to hand you $11,000 for your crushed ftdx9000d. that would be his mortgage payment, car payment, store rent, kids expenses for probably 6 months. good luck getting that "nice guy" to hand you some serious jack... best 73 paul w8jn
i agree with everything you have said except..... the ups store has nothing to do with ups. they are not owned or controlled by ups. the ups stores are independent franchisees. if they botch a packing job (as they do 99% of the time with delicate electronics), the UPS company will kiss you goodbye since they do not have any business arrangement with you. the shipper IS the franchisee and you do not exist in the eyes of ups. you have no legal claim against ups. the court sees you as a third party, and a third party cannot bring a lawsuit against ups. you will now have to deal directly with the independent owner , who is not going to hand you $11,000 for your crushed ftdx9000d. that would be his mortgage payment, car payment, store rent, kids expenses for probably 6 months. good luck getting that "nice guy" to hand you some serious jack... best 73 paul w8jn
Not disputing that at all, But UPS franchises the "UPS STORES" and as such they do indeed get e piece of the action. As far as 98% botched packing; I can only offer the experience I have had with our local, Sterling Heights store and I give them very high marks. The owner formerly shipped precision military instruments and does a wonderful job of packing. The insurance arrrangement they have has been reported to me as excellent. Luckily I have not yet had to file a claim, thanks in large measure to the efforts of the store proprieter.
By the same token , I have RECEIVED items from other "professional" packing sources that made me shake my head.
I still prefer to do my own but presently I am recovering from (last Tuesday) having a tumor removed that was making walking and lifting nearly impossible. If all goes well I will be rolling my own again soon. Nice thing about the UPS store is he WILL accept electronics that are well packed , OEM box or not. The depot 's blanket refusal is a very sore point with me . On the rare occasions when I actually do have the OEM box more often than not I put that inside of another box. I recently shipped a Johnson Valiant to the West Coast in the OEM box. I lalso used a wooden block to support the HX XFMR just as the factory did for shipping and STILL put the OEM box within another box.
The UPS store just shipped a very fragile SABA 400 (Large, heavy 1960s German radio with a very thin wooden case) to Chile for me . I was kind of holding my breath on this one as it sold for $1575 and the shipping bill alone was $900+ ! The buyer was very fussy and nervous as well. When the item arrived , the buyer was quite happy. THe radio had been wrapped in plastic because the UPS guy knew it may sit in the rain at the Chilean airport, It was TRIPLE boxed with double thick cardboard and the radio itself was shrink wrapped to a plywood base support. It made the trip in perfect shape.
As time goes by however I am getting more and more into insisting on pick up for many items By hindsight I would not offer international shipping on a similar item again.
By the same token , I have RECEIVED items from other "professional" packing sources that made me shake my head.
I still prefer to do my own but presently I am recovering from (last Tuesday) having a tumor removed that was making walking and lifting nearly impossible. If all goes well I will be rolling my own again soon. Nice thing about the UPS store is he WILL accept electronics that are well packed , OEM box or not. The depot 's blanket refusal is a very sore point with me . On the rare occasions when I actually do have the OEM box more often than not I put that inside of another box. I recently shipped a Johnson Valiant to the West Coast in the OEM box. I lalso used a wooden block to support the HX XFMR just as the factory did for shipping and STILL put the OEM box within another box.
The UPS store just shipped a very fragile SABA 400 (Large, heavy 1960s German radio with a very thin wooden case) to Chile for me . I was kind of holding my breath on this one as it sold for $1575 and the shipping bill alone was $900+ ! The buyer was very fussy and nervous as well. When the item arrived , the buyer was quite happy. THe radio had been wrapped in plastic because the UPS guy knew it may sit in the rain at the Chilean airport, It was TRIPLE boxed with double thick cardboard and the radio itself was shrink wrapped to a plywood base support. It made the trip in perfect shape.
As time goes by however I am getting more and more into insisting on pick up for many items By hindsight I would not offer international shipping on a similar item again.