Those paypal FEEs

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w3nrl
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri May 09, 2003 3:23 pm

Those paypal FEEs

Post by w3nrl » Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:38 pm

:) For those who advertise a item to be sold and request paypal and say add 2.9% to the price, well if you read the paypal site this is not always true those fees do NOT have to be put on the price of the item
this is from the paypal site:"

Send money Receive money

Free when the money comes from PayPal balance or bank account.


when the money comes from a debit or credit card or PayPal Credit

(the sender decides who pays this fee).

Now mine funds comes from my bank account which is protected as well and yet i have been paying that 3% in the past..NO MORE!!!!
Read the site on paying with paypal before paying
Best of 73
de w3nrl
nick

K9XR
Posts: 416
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:51 pm

paypal

Post by K9XR » Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:53 pm

The low or no fee only applies to low usage personal accounts with very low usage limits. There are also ways to send money as "personal" like it is a gift but there is no paypal protection on those transactions.

KA9MOT
Posts: 281
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:40 pm

Post by KA9MOT » Tue Mar 09, 2010 3:59 pm

The buyer shouldn't be paying the "seller fees" anyway.

If the seller wants payment or is willing to accept payment via PayPal he needs to pay his own fees.I believe that is also in PayPal's user agreement.
Steve - KA9MOT

K9XR
Posts: 416
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:51 pm

Post by K9XR » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:10 pm

OR the seller can just choose not to accept paypal

KA9MOT wrote:The buyer shouldn't be paying the "seller fees" anyway.

If the seller wants payment or is willing to accept payment via PayPal he needs to pay his own fees.I believe that is also in PayPal's user agreement.

KA9MOT
Posts: 281
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:40 pm

Post by KA9MOT » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:21 pm

Agreed!
K9XR wrote:OR the seller can just choose not to accept paypal

KA9MOT wrote:The buyer shouldn't be paying the "seller fees" anyway.

If the seller wants payment or is willing to accept payment via PayPal he needs to pay his own fees.I believe that is also in PayPal's user agreement.
Steve - KA9MOT

w3nrl
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri May 09, 2003 3:23 pm

stand somewhat corrected

Post by w3nrl » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:57 pm

Best of 73
de w3nrl
nick

w3nrl
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri May 09, 2003 3:23 pm

Post by w3nrl » Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:01 pm

Sorry guys I stand somewhat corrected use the site above for more info


thxn
[/b]
Best of 73
de w3nrl
nick

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

real simple

Post by w8jn » Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:02 pm

i never advertise that i accept paypal. if the buyer asks me to accept paypal, i indicate, to send pmo or certified check or personal check until clear with no fees. if the buyer insists on paypal, they must eat the fees. they do not have to pay fees, simply send me a check snail mail.
happy hoss trading paul w8j n

lhk0pd
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Location: dodge city kansas
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Post by lhk0pd » Wed Mar 10, 2010 2:55 am

Well like or dislike Pay Pal or how it runs it's business but i got scammed off a ad on QTH and Pay Pal refunded my money $860.00. So i personally like there service and have used pay pal since there inception. As far as buyers paying fees i do not request it but have done it with a buyer but usually for less than my cost.
Larry Huff K0pd

K8AC
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Location: Angier, NC
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Paypal fees

Post by K8AC » Wed Mar 10, 2010 11:57 am

Here's the way I look requests for the buyer to pay the fees: The agreement that each Paypal user agrees to when signing up for the service clearly specifies that a seller may NOT charge fees to the buyers for using Paypal. If a person is able and willing to ignore what he's agreed to to maximize his profit, I figure he wouldn't hesitate to be less than honest with me and he's not someone I will do business with. I've bought tons of stuff using this site over the years, but have never bought anything from anyone who stated he was charging the Paypal fees to the buyer.

The seller could simply increase his price slightly and fold in the fees (just as every retailer in America has done to cover credit card fees). I gladly pay the Paypal fees when selling because I get the money quickly and safely.

lhk0pd
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Post by lhk0pd » Wed Mar 10, 2010 2:01 pm

K8AC....Your making quite a assumption about a person that ask for the fees be paid by the buyer. Like i said in my other quote i have done it but not often and i consider my self quite honest as i'm certain Paul W8jn does and his record and mine bear that out. In fact i'm certain you have possibly insulted quite a few with that statement. No you do not have to buy mine or anybody's item whether they ask for there pay pal fee's be paid by the buyer or not,but to just assume there less than being honest is not a true and fair opinion. To be quite frank in all the years i've used Pay Pal i do not recall them saying i could not charge a buyer for the fee's outside of E Bay not allowing it.
Larry Huff K0pd

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

deceptive ads

Post by w8jn » Wed Mar 10, 2010 3:46 pm

joe,
i assume you are suggesting i "jack up"
my fees and cheat all of those hams who would paypal me, and give a discount to those sending a pmo? kind of like getting that $20,000 discount on a car worth $5000 because the dealer "jacked up" price with a fake price to give a "pretend discount". remember, i do not offer paypal and list the price pretty close to where i want it. if the seller insists on paypal and i have a 9000mp, icom 9500, alpha 9500 etc... i should take a $200- $300 loss or i should tell the buyer to go "piss up a rope" i am not going to sell to him? i respect your right to , not pay the fees as a buyer. you certainly will not be buying from me IF you insist on paypal. am i violating paypals rules? they can shut me down if they want i really dont care.
larry you were fortunate with your refund from paypal. they do not cover crooks and conmen. you happened to buy from someone who left money in their account and paypal snatched it for you. if there is no money in the "bad guys" account, paypal is not going to reimburse you.
happy hoss trading, paul w8jn

K8AC
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Location: Angier, NC
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Paypal fees

Post by K8AC » Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:07 pm

Of course, I'm free to make any personal assumptions I deem appropriate in my personal transactions. I suspect just about all users of Paypal have never read through the mice-type of what they agreed to when they signed up for Paypal. I had a rather serious problem with eBay and Paypal a few years back that resulted in my combing through the details very carefully. It's very clearly stated in the agreement, and I could find the information and quote it here if you are unable to find it.

If you or any other Paypal user IS aware of the restriction regarding charging Paypal fees to a buyer who pays with Paypal, but choose to ignore it, then I'd be interested in hearing what your reasoning is in willfully violating the agreement. I know that many people who use Paypal are not happy with having to do so. Paypal continues to have extremely poor customer service and operates what amounts to a banking operation while remaining completely outside of U.S. and state banking regulation.

Before I enter into any transaction (exceeding, say, $100) on QTH.com or any other such site, I routinely check for any complaints against the seller (via Google search, not feedback forums). Any indication that the seller has ever shown a tendency to not follow commonly accepted rules of behavior is cause for concern. If someone pointed out to me that I was doing something that blatantly violated an agreement I had made, I'd first verify he was right, then I'd modify my behavior.

It's hard for me to understand how anyone would be insulted by someone pointing out that they had violated an agreement. Ignorance of the details of the agreement is understandable, but continuing the practice after knowing the facts is not.

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

i agree

Post by w8jn » Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:18 pm

joe,
i am not insulted by you pointing out the facts. my reasoning is real simple. i know the paypal rules, i read the fine print carefully. i choose to violate the rules. that sounds pretty simple to me (kind of like civil disobedience) ??? eventually ebay and paypal are going to be investigated by the feds for their monopolistic business practices (ebay owns paypal) and they will be fined for establishing rules that violate the sherman anti trust laws. think back to when standard oil owned the wells, tankwagons, routes and gas stations and held stock in their competitors, to artificially control the market and inflate prices, like ebay and paypal do...
happy hoss trading paul w8jn
Last edited by w8jn on Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

K8AC
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Contact:

Paypal fees

Post by K8AC » Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:21 pm

For the others who are not familiar with the agreement, here are the fine points:

From the Paypal user agreement:

"4.5 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions."

And from Section 8 of the agreement, dealing with the subject of fees:

"Overview.

Fees are based on whether you are making a Purchase Payment or a Personal Payment.

A Purchase Payment is a payment received for any of the following:

* A sale of goods or services (a “Commercial Transaction”);
* A payment you received after using the “Request Money” tab on the PayPal website;
* A payment you received for a donation; or
* A payment that is sent to, or received by, a business or other commercial or non-profit entity.

A Personal Payment is:

* Amounts sent to a friend or family member without a purchase. Personal Payments include, but are not limited to, sending a gift to a friend, or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill; and
* Personal Payments must be sent between two individual persons (not to or from a business).

For Purchase Payments, the recipient of the payment will always pay the fee."

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

thanks for the details

Post by w8jn » Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:25 pm

joe, please re-read my edited last post. i know the rules, i choose to ignore them for reasons stated in my previous post.
happy hoss trading. paul w8jn

lhk0pd
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Post by lhk0pd » Wed Mar 10, 2010 10:22 pm

Paul i do not think the scammer had left any funds in their acct as it was set up using the call of another ham. He first called Pay Pal and complained and then i followed.We both spoke to the person in charge of security in Omaha Nebraska and mind you all this was three days after i allowed my self to get suckered. As security told me it was because i was under there guaranteed protection and the scammer used there service illegally. I'm sorry if i'm not to detailed but i'm lousy at recalling every little detail.As for Joe i just finished reading some of the contractual agreement and realized that since i first used Pay Pal going back to i believe 1998 that they have since made many changes in the agreement. But under international service they mention that the seller can or buyer can be charged fees but not both. But like i said earlier i always thought the not to charge buyers your fees was only for E Bay as i only learned of that when a item i was bidding on got removed because the seller said that his pay pal fees would be added to the total cost.
Larry Huff K0pd

w8er
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:53 pm
Location: Vermilion, Ohio

Fees and PayPal

Post by w8er » Thu Mar 11, 2010 5:46 am

K8AC is absolutely correct. When you sign up for a Paypal account, you agree in section 4.5 of the agreement not to pass on Paypal charges. Maybe people don't read the agreement carefully?

Paul W8JN Said "i know the paypal rules, i read the fine print carefully. i choose to violate the rules."

WOW! You admit to openly violating your agreement with them because you don't agree with what you agreed to? :lol: If you think so little of them, why use them at all? Can't you go cash or bank check only and be honest about it?

I guess we can see where being a man of your word has gone!

:roll: :roll: :roll:

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

thats what i said

Post by w8jn » Thu Mar 11, 2010 6:27 am

like i said. i only advertise cash or bank check. those who demand paypal have the option of bank check, cash or paying the paypal fees. they can avoid fees by sending snailmail. its their option. i insist on a "check in the mail" if they demand paypal over my options of cash or check only, they have two choices, pay the fees of dont buy from me. its their choice, not mine. i am not holding a gun to their heads. they make the choice. not me! pay the fees, or send me a check snail mail and no fees. no apology here!
happy hoss trading paul w8jn
ps, believe it or not, i accept personal checks i encourage you to examine my feedback with a fine tooth comb and find one person unhappy with anything i have swapped sold or hoss traded...

w8er
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:53 pm
Location: Vermilion, Ohio

W8JN

Post by w8er » Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:57 pm

I hoped that I was clear in what I said but obviously not.

It doesn't matter if you take cash, worms or Krugerrands. The telling issue is that you openly admit to accepting the Paypal agreement, understanding it's provisions, and violating what you agreed to because it suits you. You aren't even apologetic about it but rather try to justify your blatant disregard through some mumbo jumbo about business practices and Sherman Anti-trust laws. Canceling your Paypal account and not dealing with them at all, at least shows that you don't like their terms and won't agree to them. That's honest.

I have seen some very interesting items in your ads. You may well have excellent feedback, you probably never screwed one trader! BUT with your blatant disregard for honesty, my crystal ball says that it's only a matter of time.

I really am not up to arguing semantics and wish only to show my respect for the posts by K8AC. I only know you through what you have written here and have had no dealings with you, good or bad. I wish you well and your customers even more well!

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

no apologies here

Post by w8jn » Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:11 pm

you and i see it 180degrees opposite. i insist on pmo personal checks or cert checks.. the buyer insists that they will violate the agreement by forcing me to accept paypal and covering the fees. do i apologize because they disregard the rules ? no way! i am even so thoughtful, that i dont even turn them in for asking me to violate the rules on their behalf. i suggest you track down all of the rules violators who buy from me and turn them in. in addition you should begin a campaign to protect me from unscrupulous buyers and warn them to not offer paypal to me. i would be in your debt if you protect me from the rule breakers.
happy hoss trading paul w8jn
ps were you a hall or lunch room monitor in elementary school? i'll bet you were the best. nobody broke the rules and got away with it when you were on duty !
Last edited by w8jn on Fri Mar 12, 2010 2:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

KS4ED
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2005 8:50 pm

Right up to...

Post by KS4ED » Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:47 pm

This was a good forum exchange right up to...
Hall monitor?
Lunch room monitor?
Hmmm... parting shot or just very recent memories?

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

youre back

Post by w8jn » Fri Mar 12, 2010 2:28 am

wow, peeps, youre back!!! it just wasnt any fun without you!!! actually you are correct on this one. it was a good discussion right up to the point where my pal anticipated dishonesty from me because of some psychotic break he had with the reality of my 10 year spotless proven track record of honesty integrity and beating my brains out recovering money stolen from hams by crooks. like the time i drove for 4 hours from cincinnati to toledo to convince a fellow ham that he should not steal money from a fellow ham in poland. guess what... out of nowhere our pal in toledo had a change of heart and sent my pal in poland his $$$ back.
best 73 and happy hoss trading paul w8jn
check out this link and see who protects our fellow hams!
http://chat.qth.com/viewtopic.php?t=1692

KS4ED
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2005 8:50 pm

Still...

Post by KS4ED » Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:18 am

Still calling people names.
I'll go along with you beating your brains out.
Again, right up to your unnecessary parting shot.
All of your "do good" is of your own bragging.
Be careful of that white horse you're riding...
sometimes they buck.

w8jn
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2003 1:21 pm

har har har

Post by w8jn » Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:48 am

peeps you are always good for a laugh. when you have no facts, your bloviating isn't even creative. nyuk nyuk nyuk....... ok pinnochio, why did you stick your growing nose in this one. do you have a dog in this fight, or are you just expelling methane? cow flatulence adds to global warming. are you trying to compete?
happy hoss trading paul w8jn

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