Page 1 of 2

Dihonest Non Ham warning

Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:37 pm
by nz9r
Do not deal with non ham Joe Palmer who has listed a DX-160 receiver for trade.
I sent him a postal money order for $60.00.He cashed it on 1-30-2008.
I have not received the receiver and he has offerd the receiver for sale to another ham for $50.00.Don't get scammed like I did!!His ad is still on qth.com

This guy needs to be put into jail for internet fraud! His email address is palmer60@bellsouth.net.
[/b]

Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:40 pm
by N4ATS
WOW , thats really strange because I have had some deals with Joe and never had a problem. However it may not be the same Joe Palmer. Whats his call?

Joe Palmer

Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:38 pm
by nz9r
The Joe Palmer I am refering to is not a Ham.
I stated the Joe Palmer I am refering to is a non ham in my orginal posting.

The Joe Palmer I am refering to lives in Columbia,TN.This guy has not answered any of my emails. I have talked to him once on the telephone and he has since changed his number to an unpublished number.

Whoa!

Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:47 pm
by K4ICL
He cashed your Money Order on 1/30/2008 and you have not received the package yet, on 2/1/2008--THE NEXT DAY?

Perhaps Joe needs a little time to pack it and get it mailed and then give the carrier time to get to your QTH?

The current Joe Palmer DX-160 ad on QTH.com Classified was posted by Palmer on 1/20/2008, ten days before he cashed you MO.

Am I completely missing something in your post?

K4ICL

Joe Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:24 am
by nz9r
The money order was mailed priority mail.He has had plenty of time to send me the receiver.Trust me on this,this guy is dishonest.

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 4:35 am
by K4JC
Whoa! NZ9R you need to chill! Unless Mr. Palmer overnighted your radio to you, it will take a couple to a few days to arrive, no matter what shipping service was used. I sent a package via USPS last fall from Florida to Texas, and it took 31 days to arrive! Wait a reasonable period of time, then contact the seller to see what's up.

Mr.Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:41 pm
by nz9r
Overnighted my receiver ?Did Mr.Palmer tell you that?
I wonder why Mr.Palmer hasn't emailed me informing me he overnighted the receiver.
Why hasn't he emailed me the tracking number?
Why did Mr. Palmer offer to sell the same receiver to a ham friend of mine for $50.00 the day after (as you claim) he overnighted it?Why would he offer it for sale to another person (a ham friend of mine) for $50.00 when he sold it to me for $60.00
Why did Mr.Palmer change his telephone number to an unpublished number the day after I talked to him on the telephone requesting the shipping information?
Why didn't Mr.Palmer inform me he was going to change his telephone number to an unpublished number?
If you have any dealings with this guy I hope he doesn't do you the same as he has done to me.
Regards.

Mr.Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:49 pm
by nz9r
K4JC,I replied to your posting in haste,I see after rereading your post that you say if he "overnighted" the receiver. I guarantee you that is not the case.
The receiver has not been shipped and I doubt that it ever will be.
Regards

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:33 pm
by hamradman
NZ9R,
Now let me get this right, you said he cashed your money order on 1-30-2008 and you are upset because you did not receive the radio the next day on 2-1-2008? Are you nuts? Unless he lives next door to you give it some time to get to you.
Also, how do you know that he has the same radio listed for sale again? Selling one to you for $60 and another for $50 could he have had two of them?

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:16 pm
by WO2X
I guess the question is, when did Mr. Palmer receive the money order? Even though he cashed it on 1/30, when did he receive it?

Hopefully you can get resolution.

Mr.Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:32 pm
by nz9r
I am not sure when Mr.Palmer received the money order.It was sent as priority mail on Jan. 22nd 2008.
As for hamradmans' question am I nuts?,my answer to you is, I only discuss my mental and health issues with my healthcare providers.Thank you.

The money order was cashed on 1-30-2008 that does not mean the money order was received that day, only that it was cashed on that day.

Re: Mr.Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 4:28 pm
by wa4cch
nz9r wrote:I am not sure when Mr.Palmer received the money order.It was sent as priority mail on Jan. 22nd 2008.
As for hamradmans' question am I'm nuts?,my answer to you is, I only discuss my mental and health issues with my healthcare providers.Thank you.

The money order was cashed on 1-30-2008 that does not mean the money order was received that day, only that it was cashed on that day.
:roll: Hello is it possible that the day he cashed the money order is the day he shipped maby he needed the money to ship it give him a few more days
before you bash him if it don't show up in a week or so then call him a crook
73 chuck 8)

Mr Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 7:01 pm
by nz9r
WA4CCH, According to Mr.Palmers email dated Tuesday January 2008 at 4:00pm
The receiver was shipped that day.
I have all the emails Mr.Palmer and I sent to one another plus the photo of the receiver.
He also sent the exact same photo to a ham friend of mine when my ham friend
ask him to.He offerd to sell it my ham friend for $50.00
This was after he already sold it to me.That doesn't make any since to me, if he did
indeed have two seperate receivers to sell, why would he send the exact same picture to my friend?

Gee, what is in a day one way or another...

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:24 pm
by K4ICL
Tuesday January 2008 at 4:00pm
This date had no day given. It is meaningless. January has FIVE Tuesdays in it. ...

K4ICL

Mr Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:08 pm
by nz9r
K4ICL

The dated email from Mr Palmer is Tuesday, January 22, 2008 4:10 PM
According to MR Palmers email the receiver was shipped on that day.


[/b]

Okay...

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:28 pm
by K4ICL
Let me see if I understand this.

He posted his ad to sell the DX-160 on the 20th of Jan.

You send him a Money Order, Priority, on 22 Feb.

He sent you an email saying he shipped it to you on Jan 22, before he receives payment for the receiver.

Sometime between Jan 22 and Jan 31 he receives your money order.

He does not cash your money order until Jan 31.

You post your first message on the topic on Feb 1 saying "This guy needs to be put into jail for internet fraud!"

Is the above stated events correct and in order?

Another question: Why did he ship the receiver before receiving payment?

K4ICL

Mr.Palmer

Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 11:55 pm
by nz9r
K4ICL
Yes the events are in order.However,the money order according to the post office was cashed on January 30, 2008.In Mr.Palmers email dated January 21, 2008 12:00 PM.He states in his email "The radio is boxed up and ready to ship tomorrow" That is what HIS email states.I understood tomorrow to be January 22 ,2008.In an email sent by Mr.Palmer dated January 22, 2008 4:10 PM H e states " the radio was shipped" that is what he stated in his email.As to why he said he would ship the receiver before he received payment only Mr.Palmer can answer that.I have all of the emails that were exchanged between Mr.Palmer and I pertaining to this transaction.I have eveything documented pertaining to this situation.I have documentation where he tried to sell it to a ham buddy of mine after he emailed me stating the receiver had been shipped to me.My ham buddy and I received identical photos of the receiver sent by Mr.Palmer after my ham buddy and I requested photos.There is more to this story but I don't have room to type all of it here.Mr.Palmer has changed his telephone number to an unpublished number and there is more to that story.Going back to my ham buddy,on a hunch I had my ham buddy email Mr Palmer and express an interest in the receiver.Mr.Palmer sent an exact photo
to my ham buddy and said he would sell it to him and that was after he said he had shipped the receiver to me.
Update 2-4-2008 The post office has confirmed the money order was delivered to Mr.Palmers address on 01/24/2008.According to my local sheriff department this matter is out of their hands.According to them the only recourse I have is to hire an attorney and take civil action against Mr.Palmer.
I discussed this matter with my local Post Master and according to her there is one other thing I can do.According to her if what I am telling her about this situation is true.Mr Palmer has commited mail fraud and she is going to give all of my information to the US Postal Inspectors.The only reason I posted this situation about Mr.Palmer is not to discredit him but to stop acts of fraud.This kind of behavior exhibited by Mr. Palmer or anyone else needs to be stopped.

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:48 pm
by n5wrx
That Postal Money Order for $50 covered shipping also ?

WOW ... what some guys wont do for $50.

Old hams are getting older and memory is the first thing to go.
Cant remember what the second thing is.

Perhaps he is so old he just forgot he sold that radio once already.
Good to see he still remembers how to get to the post office so he can cash the money orders.

Thank you NZ9R for the heads up as he might forget and sell it again.

Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 7:11 pm
by N5KBP
I'm curious. Is this deal still hanging?

Mr. Palmer

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 11:47 am
by nz9r
Yes,This issue is still hanging.I have not received the receiver as 11 Feb 2008
regards, Kyle.

rule # 4

Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:41 pm
by w8jn
all this hand wringing and stress for $60? had you read rule #4 before you sent $60 to a non ham, all of this would have been avoided. you allowed the scam to occur.
http://chat.qth.com/viewtopic.php?t=22

Mr. Palmer

Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:10 pm
by nz9r
W8JN
Hmmmmm.Thank you for the information on rule #4.Hand wringing over $60.00?
Maybe you have missed my intentions on this warning and just incase you have allow me to enlighten you.The $60.00 I am out will not put me into bankruptcy.My intent was to stop a scam from getting out of hand.If you will reread my earlier posting you will see the comment I made about fraud.
Maybe I did invite this unfortunate event but it does not excuse Mr.Palmer or anyone else who commits fraud.I suppose because a bank opens for business
and gets robbed they brought that upon themselves too?Hmmmm.
regards.

bank

Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:39 pm
by w8jn
a bank has security cameras and a vault. when was the last time you visited a bank that had no security and placed all its cash on the floor in the lobby? all things have risk. we attempt to minimize the risk. i do not need to be warned about a scam that involves sending cash to a non ham without checking him out. leave your keys in the car??? was it stolen???? no whining on that one!

spelling

Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 2:18 am
by kc6ond
enlighten...not inlighten, You should not deal with a non-ham, but maybe...just maybe, things will still turn out ok. I have seen a honest deal between 2 honest hams..go haywire due to a miscommunication, or slow mail, and as one ham stated above, yes I too have had to wait on a package for a few weeks because it got put on the wrong truck by some guy in a UPS hub. Things do happen. Maybe the case, maybe not the case, but you were hasty in calling the man a crook. I do hope it turns out okay for you. And if it does, I hope you'll be man enough to apologize to the fellow. Could be he has 20 or 30 of the item you purchased for sale. If not...internet fraud is a crime, and can be punished by the internet crimes division of the FBI. 73's and good luck.

fbi ?????

Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 5:20 am
by w8jn
The FBI is going to investigate a $60 internet scam? As soon as they catch D.B. Cooper, the $60 will be found next... har har har. $60, $600? $6000????? the FBI has more on their hands than a ham who fell for the "give me $60 and I will send you some stuff... wait right here in this parking lot, I will be back in an hour with your stuff" Right up there with some people thinking that Paypal will protect them and a postal money order will have the postal police possie at your door ready to "gitt'em boys". Ask questions... afraid to ask? afraid you will offend the seller then by all means send money to an electronic black hole that you never met across the USA! You are a target......