When PayPal "Protection" doesn't work...

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As of Dec 9, 2013: ONLY BUYERS AND SELLERS directly involved with a transaction can post here. Do not post replies in any topic if you are not the buyer or seller in the transaction being discussed! If you believe you can help the buyer or seller, please use the Private Message system to communicate with them. NOTE: if you have been scammed by someone pretending to be a ham, please post in the Scammer Reports forum instead. See viewtopic.php?f=2&t=136 for additional rules.
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K4ICL
Posts: 663
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Greenville, SC
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When PayPal "Protection" doesn't work...

Post by K4ICL » Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:18 pm

I recently received an item from a ham that arrived with a bent cover due to very poor packing.

I removed the damaged cover and repaired the bent portion of the cover and replaced the cover, thinking that was the end of it.

The next day I tested the unit and found a band switch with three band position contacts completely burned away.

Because the unit was sold as being in EXCELLENT condition, and wasn't, I requested a refund from the seller, who refused.

I escalated the matter to PayPal to discover PayPal will not process claims if the unit is not is the same condition as it arrived. Even, if it is in better condition, due to a buyer's repair work.

Lessons Learned:
  • 1) Test the equipment right out of the box. Don't fix or clean anything.
    2) Keep a written record of all faults discovered as well as the methods you used to test the unit.
    3) Don't repair or attempt to repair any faults found with the item, don't even replace a blown fuse.
    4) Take pictures of any and all damage you discover, if possible.
    5) Keep ALL of the packing material until your fully accept the item.
    6) Prepare any statements to PayPal PRIOR to contacting them--the PayPal site has a time limit and you will find yourself repeating some of the input due to being "timed out."
There is no "risk free" way to buy anything but knowing some of the rules of the road helps!

K4ICL

W4AIN
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Louisville, KY

Post by W4AIN » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:11 am

...
Last edited by W4AIN on Thu May 10, 2012 9:27 am, edited 2 times in total.

K4ICL
Posts: 663
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Greenville, SC
Contact:

Response to W4AIN...

Post by K4ICL » Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:10 pm

Why do you assume he was dishonest?

Being ignorant of how to pack electronic equipment does not make a ham dishonest!

Failing to test an item before it is resold, doesn't mean the seller is always dishonest, either.


In this particular case, the likely scenario is the seller obtained the item from another ham and, never using it, "flipped" it to gain a little spending money. The fault I found could only be be discovered by testing the item for functionality. Apparently, this wasn't done.

The sellers fault was his not testing it before he turned around and sold it to another ham. This is not dishonesty, since there is no evidence he intended to deceive and it is highly likely he was totally unaware the unit was internally damaged.

It IS negligence, however.

In this case, WHO is unimportant. He has already learned of the error of his ways.

This feedback has to with HOW avoid having to pay to repair a defective item, paid for using PayPal, regardless of WHY the item is defective -- damaged in shipment, undetected faults, etc.

As a side note: In my opinion, I see a lot of useless and often damaging "Judge Judy" attitude in this Forum. The purpose of feedback is not to hold court, but to provide useful, needed information regarding potential problem areas, when buying and selling on QTH.com.

K4ICL

k4kk
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 12:20 am
Location: The great state of Tennessee

Re: Response to W4AIN...

Post by k4kk » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:21 pm

K4ICL wrote:As a side note: In my opinion, I see a lot of useless and often damaging "Judge Judy" attitude in this Forum. The purpose of feedback is not to hold court, but to provide useful, needed information regarding potential problem areas, when buying and selling on QTH.com.

K4ICL
AMEN! Simple errors turn into pi$$ing contests.

kk9a
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 7:06 pm
Location: Midland, NC

Re: Response to W4AIN...

Post by kk9a » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:03 pm

K4ICL wrote:Why do you assume he was dishonest?
You said "Because the unit was sold as being in EXCELLENT condition, and wasn't, I requested a refund from the seller, who refused"

Why would you need to file a PayPal dispute with an honest seller?.
Last edited by kk9a on Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

K4ICL
Posts: 663
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Greenville, SC
Contact:

Again...

Post by K4ICL » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:04 pm

As I have already stated: The seller refused my request to refund.

Consider this; perhaps he thought I was being dishonest and had damaged the unit, when I tested it.

If so, his suspicion that I was being dishonest caused an issue which causes you to ask me why I did not question his honesty.

When does this crap stop?

If I KNEW this particular seller was NOT being honest, I would have said so.

K4ICL

kk9a
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 7:06 pm
Location: Midland, NC

Re: Again...

Post by kk9a » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:42 pm

K4ICL wrote:If I KNEW this particular seller was NOT being honest, I would have said so.
Would you buy from him again?

lhk0pd
Posts: 715
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:01 pm
Location: dodge city kansas
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Post by lhk0pd » Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:02 pm

K4ICL What it all boils down to is a catch 22 Darned if you do and darned if you don't. I would guess if there was a declared winner it would have to be the seller an Pay Pal. But on the other side of the coin i understand where your coming from also.
Larry Huff K0pd

K4ICL
Posts: 663
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Greenville, SC
Contact:

What a question...

Post by K4ICL » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:42 am

kk9a:

Nah, he seems to have spats of negligence; makes me cranky.

k0pd:

No winner. No looser. Just trying to make swimming against the stream a little more exciting.

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